Justin Vacula reacts to a viral Dave Ramsey Show clip where a caller says she has around $90,000 in student loan debt, has been with her boyfriend for six years, and says he will not propose until she is debt-free.
He pays her rent, they’ve been together for six years, but Dave Ramsey and his co-host Jade says this isn’t good enough. In this reaction, Justin responds to Dave Ramsey and Jade Warshaw telling the caller to “dump him,” calling the boyfriend toxic, and suggesting she “deserves” someone better. Jade Warshaw also calls living together before marriage “a bum idea.”
Justin argues that the situation is more complicated than that. He questions why the boyfriend is being framed as the villain when he is already financially supporting the household and may simply want to avoid taking on legal and financial liability before marriage.
Original Dave Ramsey Video
Justin discusses student loan debt, marriage expectations, cohabitation before marriage, financial compatibility, personal responsibility, and whether it is reasonable for someone to wait until debt is paid off before proposing. He also points out what he sees as a contradiction between Ramsey’s usual anti-debt message and the advice given in this clip.
Timestamps:
00:00 Viral Ramsey Clip Setup
01:22 Caller Debt And Context
03:02 Boyfriend Won’t Propose Yet
04:01 “Dump Him” Reaction
06:57 Princess Queen Narrative
07:58 Living Together Twist
09:08 Cohabitation Debate
11:20 Jade Warshaw says living together before marriage is a “bum idea”
15:44 Debt Alignment Contradictions
19:26 Marriage And Debt Standards
22:15 Premarital Counseling Spin
27:32 Final Takeaways And Sign Off
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Rough Transcript:
Justin Vacula here with the Hurdy Gurdy Travel Podcast. I’m back with another reaction video to Dave Ramsey. It’s been a while, and this clip from Dave Ramsey, “My boyfriend makes $250,000 but won’t marry me until I pay off my debt”, is going viral. Dave Ramsey is telling the caller, “You should dump your boyfriend unless he gives you $90,000 to pay off your student loans.”
The boyfriend, according to the caller, says he won’t marry her unless she’s debt-free, and Dave Ramsey jumps to the nuclear option of dump him, leave him, and they heap scorn upon him and praise her, the caller that they know little to nothing about. People still share Dave Ramsey, “Oh, he has good advice, Justin.
Oh, he’s good for some people, Justin,” even though he says ridiculous things like this. He’s been accused of pushing fraudulent timeshare companies. He’s been accused of firing employees for reasons such as violating Christian principles, for having bedroom [00:01:00] fun outside of marriage or being pregnant. Pick one.
People still support Dave Ramsey, so let’s respond to this and see will you still support Dave Ramsey? In the commenters, what excuses are you going to make this time to say, “Oh, Dave Ramsey’s not so bad. He has some good idea about personal finance”? Well, here he has terrible ideas about personal finance and terrible ideas about relationships.
Here we go. I’ve been with my boyfriend for a little over six years, and I graduated, uh, in D- December 2023 with about- Okay, so the caller’s been with this boyfriend for six years. It seems like things are probably going okay if they’re still together after a significant amount of time. She graduated from school, and she has student loans.
I’m going to pause it because in the past there’s been copyright strikes against this for using the Ramsey com- the Ramsey clips, but this is just fair use criticism. I’m responding to the content … about 160 loans, [00:02:00] $160,000 of student loan debt. Uh, I’ve paid off a lot. I have about $90,000 left. Okay, so she still owes 90,000 on student loans.
It was at 160,000, the caller said, so she’s on the way to paying it off. There is a possible middle ground here of, “Okay, well, keep making your loan payments.” But surely men are worried about paying off or giving money, and then marriage happens, the relationship doesn’t work. It’s right to be cautious about these things.
And here’s an ad on the bottom, “Refinance your defaulted private student loans,” which is funny for the purposes of this video, but let’s continue. Um- Way to go. Thank you. And he- So, so you’re what, 24? I’m 26. 26, okay. And what’s your field of… What’s your career? I’m a nurse. Oh. “My boyfriend says he won’t marry me unless I’ve paid off all my debt” is the banner on the bottom here for those just listening to the audio Good for you.
Okay. And so you’ve got 90,000 left, [00:03:00] all right? Mm-hmm. And my boyfriend makes 250,000 a year, but he does not want to propose until I’m completely debt-free. Okay, so the boyfriend makes 250,000 a year, and that’s some kind of thought that he should just give you this $90,000? He’s saying, “Okay, I’m willing to propose later,” it seems, “But be debt-free first.”
It’s not a breakup. He’s not saying, “Oh, I don’t wanna marry you at all.” He wants to wait, and that 250,000 isn’t just extra money that he can give to pay off the student loans. Surely there’s some sort of monthly budget or monthly cost. They’re living together, maybe let’s say about 3K, 4K a month. So for a full year, this isn’t 250,000 in extra money that he could just give you to pay off student loans.
Hmm. Interesting. You’re not gonna like me. You’re not gonna like Dave. Let’s see what he has to say. [00:04:00] If you were my daughter, you wanna know what I would tell you? What? Dump him. Wow. So they’ve been together for six years. She’s in the process of paying off student loans, but he’s just saying, “Hey, I don’t want to marry you, take on this 90,000 in debt, and I’d like you to be debt-free.”
This is an expectation the guy probably has about, “Here are things that I would like for you to be or have before we get married.” Women have preferences. Men have preferences. It seems like this is a preference that he’s set. Now, it doesn’t mean that he’s going to break up with you because you have student loan debt.
Maybe, “Hey, just pay off the student loan debt, and then we’ll marry a few years later.” But Dave Ramsey, black-and-white world Dave Ramsey here, “Just dump him.” Not wait, not stay together, not give it a chance, not, “Hey, here’s a plan to pay off your 90K.” Now, with many other callers, Dave Ramsey will say, “You need to get out of debt immediately.
Debt is the worst thing ever. Debt is horrible. Debt [00:05:00] is crushing. You’re a slave. This is terrible. You’re getting screwed,” is what he often has to say. But in this case, it’s just dump the guy because he won’t give you $90,000 or you’re not willing to wait. Yeah, I mean, he’s a great guy, like- No, he’s not. No.
So the caller says he’s a great guy. They’ve been together for six years, and Dave Ramsey just interrupts the co-host Jade Warshaw, “No, no, no. Oh, he’s not a great guy. He’s not a great guy ’cause he won’t give you $90,000.” He’s not. No, he’s not. He’s ma- No, he’s not … he’s making you prove your worth. He’s making you prove your worth, or he’s just saying, “Hey, I’d like you to pay off the student loans before we get married.”
Based on money- Yeah … to him. Based on money to him. Okay, guys have standards. “Hey, I don’t want to marry someone who has debt.” Or $90,000 in debt. Women [00:06:00] might have preferences of, “I’d like a man to make 100K a year, 150K a year.” Is Dave Ramsey going to shout at them? You’re having to buy your way into this relationship.
You’re having to buy your way into this relationship. That’s interesting, because Dave Ramsey has been encouraging people to be debt-free, pay off debt, and so on, in past relationships, and I don’t think that he would recommend, uh, I would think, getting in relationships with people who have high car payments, they’re paying credit card interest.
Maybe that’s not a good partner to get involved with someone who’s in debt. Now, they’ve been together for six years. This guy’s already made a choice knowing the state of the student loans. But he doesn’t want to marry. He could say, “We’re going to live together, we’ll be in a relationship,” but marriage is a different decision.
There’s a lot of liability with that should things not work out, and should she want a divorce. Nope. You’re a princess and you deserve more than this. [00:07:00] You’re a princess and you deserve… Oh, queen, queen. How does he even know? The call- this is just Haley, this caller. There’s no preexisting relationship as far as I know.
Oh, you deserve, you deserve a man who’s gonna pay off your student loans. Yeah, someone’s just gonna sign up, give you $90,000. It- it can’t just be, “Wait. Hey, here’s a plan. In the next four years, you can work on paying off this 90K. Maybe you could chuck about 25k a year and get rid of the student loans.”
Nope, dump him. You’re a queen. You’re a princess. You deserve more than this. Relationship advice from Dave Ramsey in this, again, unrealistic world that someone is just going to toss around $90,000 as inflation is continuing, gas prices are going up, cost of living is going up, and so much more. Oh yeah, let’s get married.
90,000, let’s just do that. Let’s just gamble 90,000, get married. Hopefully, it’ll work out. Yeah. Okay, Dave. The reason I’ve been able to, [00:08:00] like, uh, put like majority of my paycheck towards my loans is ’cause he does pay for all our rent, all our bills. Oh, so you live together. Okay, so the guy is paying for the rent.
They’ve been together for six years, and she still wants this 90,000, or Dave wants him to give the 90,000. Now we’re getting more details of the story, but before we even had that, Dave, “Oh, he’s terrible. You should dump him. You deserve more.” Yeah, we live together. Oh, so you’re already married, but you just didn’t admit it.
Okay, living together is not necessarily being married, unless you’re in a state that says if you cohabitate for a certain amount of time, that it’s a common law or a similar type of marriage. But many people will wanna live together before they get married, Dave, to see how it goes, rather than just living separately, then you move someone in, and then a few months or a year later, then they just turn out being lazy, miserable, whatever the case might be It’s okay to live with someone before getting married, Dave.
Just like you would test drive a car [00:09:00] before purchasing the car. Yeah, it does feel like we’re married. Well, that- Yeah. Gosh. Yeah. I- The, yeah, the reactions here, “Oh, oh gosh.” Well, Dave, I would think, is a bit out of touch as he’s much older. He doesn’t know about the current dating market and how things work.
Maybe Dave and a lot of older listeners, older people, met their partner, their boyfriend, their girlfriend, in high school, in college. They got married. Things went really well. But now maybe that’s not the case. Maybe you want to know the person longer before getting married. Maybe you want to see how it progresses.
You don’t just want to go from, “Hey, we’re living separately. Things are going all right for about a year. Let’s just get married. Let’s do it.” And then things don’t work out, as divorce rates are very high, and in many cases, the laws are stacked against men, and men are being cautious about marriage. Many men are not even getting married because they think it’s too risky, Dave.[00:10:00]
Will he address that? So what, what’s his incentive to get married? None. Many men are actually thinking that. I don’t want to get married because it’s too much risk. The incentive isn’t there. Maybe you get some tax benefits, but there are a lot of other negatives, like taking on $90,000 in debt, in some cases.
Or he’s not ready. Or maybe they just recently moved in. But we don’t really have the story. Dave is not asking many questions. He’s just jumping to conclusions. Dump him. You deserve it. None. Uh. He, it’s like an air horn here. We’re at a hockey game. Well… And this, this, let me just say this, Haley, and I’m saying this because you’re gonna have relationships after this, and you’re gonna learn from this, and- It’s already over for Jade.
You can see her book in the back, Jade Warshaw. Oh, you’re gonna have relationships after this. So they’re already settled. The relationship’s over because he won’t pay the debt, because she can’t be patient. Oh, well, he’s not willing to [00:11:00] give you the 90K. Haley makes 250K. Oh yeah, what, what’s 90K? That’s just chump change, Dave Ramsey.
Uh, Dave Ramsey’s been pitching a cruise recently. You can cruise with him, and it’s like $3,000, $4,000 to go on a cruise. So, you know, 90K against student loans, whatever. No, that’s fine. And there’s people who are going to watch this call and learn from this. This is precisely why, uh, one of the reasons why living together before marriage is a, is, it’s a bum idea.
It’s not- It’s a bum idea. It’s a bum idea to say, “Hey, well, I’m considering living with you the rest of my life. So before we do that, how about we just try it for maybe a year or two, or a little bit longer, and see how it goes?” Because the reality is that people change. People play chameleon They’re nice for some time, but then over time you get to see how they really are.
When you’re living with them, when you’re with them for more time, you get more of an appraisal for how things are going. Isn’t it a [00:12:00] relief to say, “Hey, I moved someone in. It didn’t work out after a few months. We went our own ways. We- I kicked her out and things are better now, and I’m glad I didn’t tie the knot.
I’m glad things didn’t get more serious.” But oh no, it’s a bum idea to live together before you’re married. Top tier relationship advice here from the Ramsey Show. These experts, they, they got all this information. Don’t, don’t live together before marriage. You should marry and then see how it goes. Eh, just roll the dice, whatever.
not a good idea because what happens is you start to make bad relational decisions based off of the financial gain and based off of the pressure that you’ve already put on yourselves. The pressure that you’ve already put on yourselves. The guy is saying, “Hey, please be debt-free before we get married.”
That’s pressure? Or maybe that’s an expectation. Maybe he’s just being cautious. It’s all of a sudden the, the feminist show here of [00:13:00] Dave Ramsey, uh, the, the f- all the pressure. He’s putting this pressure on you. It’s a lot easier to walk away from a, a messed up relationship when he lives over here and she lives over here It’s a lot easier to walk away from a messed up relationship when you don’t get married because you tried things beforehand.
Not, oh, moving in is a bum idea before a marriage. and we just get together when it’s time to go on our dates. It’s a lot easier to go, “You know what? This guy’s a bum. I’m gonna walk away.” This guy’s a bum. The gu- the guy who’s paying for her rent and they’ve been together for six years. This guy is a bum.
It makes it a lot more difficult when suddenly you’re in the same house, and then you’re splitting the bills, and then he’s paying for the rent. It makes it ve- It makes it very difficult when he’s paying for the rent. Really? Really now? What a great position for Haley that this guy is paying for the rent, providing they’ve been together for six years, but you should [00:14:00] dump him anyway because he wants to wait and won’t give you $90,000 to pay off student loans.
The bar is so high for men right here from Jade Warshaw and Dave Ramsey relationship advice. Really, not enough. Not enough. Maybe give her 100,000, maybe pay for everything. Well, don’t even move in together. It’s a bum idea to move in before marriage. Just get married, guys. Just sign up and just see how it goes.
Ah, divorce isn’t so bad. very hard to make the natural transitions that we would have made if we had not applied that amount of pressure. And so you move… It’s very hard to break things off after marriage and just walk away without being financially liable. Imagine this guy that makes 250,000 a year. I don’t know what she’s making And then she’s unhappy.
She says he’s abusive. Oh, he put this pressure on me. That’s what Jade is saying here. Oh, so much pressure. And then now he has to pay out [00:15:00] alimony. But in Jade Warshaw’s universe, well, moving together, moving in together is a bum idea before marriage. So one would think, oh, we’ll just move in. Oh, well, it’s easy to walk away when you’re living apart.
Well, it’s going to be harder to walk away if you’ve moved in and things don’t work out because you didn’t even try moving in together. forward in a toxic, unhealthy relationship. A toxic, unhealthy relationship. Feminist Dave Ramsey. He’s so toxic. This is unhealthy. Because you chose to share an address.
Anyway, now It’s a toxic and unhealthy relationship because you chose to share an address? You’re not going to do it. I can tell by the way you’re talking. So here’s the thing. We love people getting out of debt. You know that. Here comes the but. And why do we love people getting out of debt? Because we love people and we want them to be able to prosper.
We love people getting out of debt because we love people. That’s a bit circular. [00:16:00] Okay, so then why doesn’t she get out of debt? Why is the expectation on the man to pay $90,000 against her student loans and that it’s inappropriate to wait, that you should just dump him because he’s saying now, oh, well, I expect you to be debt-free.
And I wonder if we ask the caller, Haley, was this expectation in place five years ago, four years ago, or is this just a sudden thing? Because if he said this a long time ago, hey, I’m not willing to get married unless you’re debt-free, unless you make good money, you have your own finances. These are sensible things that men will do for their own protection, Dave.
And your number one wealth building tool is your income. You have a fabulous career choice as a nurse. You’ll always be employed and you can always work as much as you want to work. Well, that’s not necessarily true. I don’t think there’s any guarantees on you’ll always be employed and you could work as much as you want to work.
That’s not realistic. You can work 80 hours a week or you can work 20 hours a week. As a nurse, you’ll be able to do that the rest of your life. Said to many people browsing LinkedIn looking for jobs, claiming [00:17:00] that they got college degrees, they went into debt and they can’t find jobs. And you can make a pile of money.
Okay, so if she can make a pile of money, then why can’t she pay off her own student loans? Why is the pressure, to borrow his word, on the man to pay off the student loans? All we tell couples to do is to be aligned, be in agreement on how money is going to be handled. Okay, so he set an expectation of I want you to be debt-free.
So why is that toxic? Why is that terrible? Now, he is in agreement that he hates debt. You’re in agreement that you’ve hated debt and you’ve been working it down. Okay, but then you’re saying dump the guy. Okay? But then he, he, um, he has put up a false block here. He put up a false block here. So Dave said, “Okay, I don’t like debt.
I don’t think people should have debt.” But then when the guy says, “I don’t want you to be in debt when we get married,” [00:18:00] he put up a false block. Not just a block, a false block. I’m just telling you, I, I, I love you and I, if you were my daughter, I’d tell you not to marry this guy. So we went to this whole thing about debt is bad, get out of debt.
Many other callers he tells aggressively pay down the debt. I listened to a clip from Dave where he told people you shouldn’t even see the inside of a restaurant until you get out of debt, that your friends will think you are in a cult because you don’t wanna go anywhere and do anything. And he’s encouraged callers to have basically no life for a year or two to pay off their debt.
Even longer than that, actually. But now it’s changed in this video with this caller, Hailey. Dump him. He’s terrible. Because this guy doesn’t like debt. Dave doesn’t like debt, but now all the standards have changed for some reason with this caller. And, uh, because I think he’s, he- this is a false premise.[00:19:00]
Um, you’re aligned on what is important. You’re aligned on, okay, we don’t like debt. We’re gonna avoid debt. We’re gonna get out of debt. Um, and that’s not a, a- people ask, have asked me should- What’s the point? Okay, yes. He, he’s against debt. The guy’s against debt. The guy doesn’t want you to be in debt when getting married, and then Dave is just stumbling and bumbling here and calling it a block.
Oh, it’s a false block. It’s this restriction. What is going on? Since I came on the air here 35 years ago, should I marry someone with debt? Mm-hmm. And the answer is always yes. Mm-hmm. As long as you love them and you’re aligned that we’re getting rid of the debt. Okay, so the woman is paying down the debt.
The guy says, “I just wanna wait.” So what’s the problem here? And then i- it’s also a side thing of men can just make choices and not be with women who are in debt, and vice versa. You could be selective in who you choose. You don’t have to get in a relationship with someone $90,000 in debt, and there shouldn’t be an [00:20:00] expectation to pay off someone else’s debt.
If you have zero debt, but one of you loves debt and hates saving, and the other one loves saving- Love… Wait, how, how do they love debt if they have zero debt? That doesn’t make any sense … and hates debt, you’re gonna get a divorce later. Okay, so the money goals are different, but the person with zero debt loves debt?
I, I don’t understand what that’s all about. Yes, if someone is in a relationship, they’re wailing out, spending all this money going to these expensive dining restaurants, they’re- buying all these expensive clothes, buying things they don’t need, getting the car loan, it’s probably not gonna work if the other person’s frugal and more sensible.
But Dave just said a person with zero debt marrying someone who loves debt, but if that person has zero debt, how do they love debt? I, I don’t understand what he’s talking about here. But if they’re both debt-free and they’re being smart about money, they’re not making foolish purchases, then what’s the [00:21:00] problem?
She’s paying down her debt, so why isn’t the advice here, “Okay, great, you’re paying down your student loan debt. He doesn’t wanna marry until it’s paid off, so why don’t you just pay off that debt in the next two years, three years,” whatever the case might be. “Oh, you’re a nurse. You can make loads of money, 80 hours a week.
Go, go to the go to work, work 80 hours a week to pay off the student loan debt.” Why isn’t the advice that when he’s mentioning that but just not applying it to the caller? All the burden’s on the man here, the big, bad, toxic man. “You should dump him,” Dave Ramsey said, “even though he pays your rent and you’ve been together for six years.
He’s terrible.” The number-one cause of divorce in North America today is money fights and money problems. And guess what this is. This is a money fight. Okay, it’s not a fight. The guy is saying, “I want you to be debt-free before we get married.” This isn’t a fight. And earlier, Dave Ramsey said about how debt is bad and people should get out of debt, so isn’t the guy echoing [00:22:00] what Dave Ramsey is saying?
This isn’t a money fight. Yeah. You’re just not having it out loud. You’re having it in your head. Yeah, that- Dave Ramsey is having a fight with himself in his head because there are so many contradictions in this video. That’s right. Now, what could be going on, and I’m gonna allow- Okay, well, Dave Ramsey already decided, but now it seems like you wanna be more charitable after you said the guy was terrible.
“You should break up with him. Six years together isn’t any good. Moving in together before marriage is a bad idea,” is what Jade Warshaw said. A little space for this. He could just be an idiot today- Oh. He’s an idiot. He’s an idiot … and he just needs to learn a little bit about what it means to be in a relationship and what- He needs to learn a bit.
He’s the worst, but Haley doesn’t have to learn anything. Haley doesn’t- she’s a princess. Give her everything. Give her 90K. Give her 180K. It’s all good. He [00:23:00] makes 250,000 … what it means to handle money together. You said one thing that might cause me to go, “I wonder if I brought this to him and, you know, saw a premarital counselor if we can get on the same pa- Saw a premarital counselor.
He- it’s all his problem here. It’s, it’s not her. It’s his problems … age, is it seemed like he was willing to help with the debt. Now, you guys aren’t, you know, married yet, but in a married relationship, it s- It, it’s not a married relationship. They’re not married yet And he didn’t say he was willing to pay off the debt, but he’s paying for the rent, so that’s less money out of her pocket and more money that she could spend toward the student loans.
Seemed like he was willing to help, but he was helping in the wrong way. He’s helping in the wrong way. Yeah, if someone wants to move in and pay for my rent and not be terrible and I could pay off other things. Oh no, that’s terrible. That’s horrible. You shouldn’t move in before marriage. It’s a [00:24:00] bum idea, Jade Warshaw says.
This guy’s the worst. Haley’s a queen.
Misguided. Misguided.
Okay, but he is paying the rent, and that’s what he said. Please pay down your student loans. I don’t want to marry you while you still have debt. So I don’t even know what to say. It’s just so bad. These clips are so bad. Contradictions, bad advice. They’re just all over the place. You’ve already decided dump him.
You’ve already decided he’s terrible. But now you’re saying, oh, well, if he’s paying the rent, then he’s giving you help. But you’re saying that’s not good enough.
Okay, but he’s already set the expectation. And you don’t have to end it. [00:25:00] You just don’t get married yet. Pay off the student loans is what the guy said, and then get married.
I won’t marry you yet. I’m not marrying you now. That’s what the guy is saying. It’s not a 100%, I’m not going to do it ever. That’s not what he said. That’s not what the caller said.
No, it’s not about that. It’s an expectation. It’s not about, oh, $90,000. It’s that I don’t want to get in a marriage with someone who has debt, then things don’t work out, and then I’m responsible for the debt. You could still have love. You can still have all these things without signing the government contract.
You don’t have to add the state to your relationship, [00:26:00] Dave Ramsey. You could have separate finances. It doesn’t have to be combined. You don’t need to have a third party, the government, in a relationship.
So he’s not good enough. He’s had you living together. He’s paying the rent. See you later, alligator. Not good enough. The guy sucks, according to Dave Ramsey. Holla, holla.
I’d be done. It’s just terrible. You know, many men are walking away from marriage because of people like Dave Ramsey, because of people like Jade Warshaw, because it’s just not enough. The bar is set so high. Men are going their own way and walking away from marriage because of these super high expectations and all this disdain toward men.
See you, [00:27:00] Felicia.
Oh, so funny. Oh, well, you’ve been together for six years. He’s paid your rent. You’ve lived together, but he’s the worst. You should just break him. See you later, alligator. Ha, ha, ha. So funny. If I were your daughter, I’d say dump him. Oh, you’re the best, Haley. You should just leave him. You’re going to learn from this.
You’re going to have other relationships. So there you have it. Bad relationship advice from Dave Ramsey. Bad money advice from Dave Ramsey, as usual. It must be nice, Dave, that you’ve been in a marriage for such a long time. It’s worked out, but it’s not the current reality today. People are being more cautious about their money.
Student loan debt and debt, as you should know, is higher. It’s different than it was decades ago when you got married. People are being more cautious. They want to live together before they get married, [00:28:00] Jade Warshaw. It’s not a bum idea, and it’s okay to have expectations. It’s okay to want to be with people who are debt-free rather than getting in a relationship, marrying, things don’t work out, and then you’re responsible for their debt.
It’s messy to walk away from. You have options. You don’t need marriage to have a relationship. Justin Vacula here with the Hurdy Gurdy Travel Podcast, signing off. Another Dave Ramsey fail.